So many choices

[wrast]

I had no idea there were so many poker tours around town. How about a new poll asking which one is best? I see each individual tour's poll but what I'd really like to know is which tour should I concentrate on the most?

[pseudoswede]

I had no idea there were so many poker tours around town. How about a new poll asking which one is best? I see each individual tour's poll but what I'd really like to know is which tour should I concentrate on the most?

We've kind of gone down that road before, and, let's just say, we shouldn't go back down it! :D

Like Gary Coleman would say, diffrn't strokes fo' diffrn't folks. Each poker tour has its good and bad things. Personally, I like The Poker Tour because most of their tournaments are located in the Parker-area. Others may like Denver Poker Tour because you can go play poker and watch t*tties bounce around on a stage on a weekend afternoon.

Try out a few and feel free to write up reviews on here.

[wrast]

Well it just so happens I'm in Parker. My time is pretty limited so not sure when I'd be able to try The Poker Tour out but I'm sure I'll get out to one sometime. Is there one you tend to play a particular night?

[pseudoswede]

Well it just so happens I'm in Parker. My time is pretty limited so not sure when I'd be able to try The Poker Tour out but I'm sure I'll get out to one sometime. Is there one you tend to play a particular night?

I actually play very little bar poker (only when the wife and kids are out of town). I usually find the closet one to my house happening that night and play (regardless of who's running it).

[PoWdA]

Well it just so happens I'm in Parker. My time is pretty limited so not sure when I'd be able to try The Poker Tour out but I'm sure I'll get out to one sometime. Is there one you tend to play a particular night?
Hey man! Welcome to the site! Here is our website, our schedule and our locations are listed here! www.thepokertour.net Come check us out sometime!

[wrast]

Hey man! Welcome to the site! Here is our website, our schedule and our locations are listed here! www.thepokertour.net Come check us out sometime!

Thanks for the welcome. I will try to get out sometime, maybe even this weekend if I can convince the wife. :)

[ThePokerTour]

PoWda, thanks for the props. If you are looking for a good game that comes with a very good dealer, find out where he deals for The Poker Tour. He is one of my best dealers.

Try any one of our venues and if you do and find that there are flaws I relish the constructive criticism. Tell me what your ideas are on how to make free bar poker a better experience.

[idh78]

Try any one of our venues and if you do and find that there are flaws I relish the constructive criticism. Tell me what your ideas are on how to make free bar poker a better experience.

I really don't want to open up this can of worms but.....

On Monday night there was an issue with one of the poker tour venues...which was totally on the bar management rather than the poker tour itself...

for some reason the bar only wanted to run three tables despite having 75 people on the list.....I think a good 15 -20 of them were turned away and another 6 or 7 left on their own....granted I don't own a bar but why would you turn away customers you obviously wouldn't otherwise have?

which brings back the old question....are there really that many "free" poker players who literally think a night out at a bar should be totally free? I know that this peticular bar does offer up great prizes....I would think the least people could do in return is give them a little patronage....but this clearly must not be happening by all of the players if they are willing to turn some of them away...


I apoligize in advance if this thread turns ugly:worried: ...but there is no need for that to happen....just thought this was an interesting topic of conversation.

[DenverPokerTour]

Unfortunately I have had many discussions of late in regards to this matter. I have spoken with Rico from The Poker Tour and some other tour operators about this recurring problem.

Many of ALL POKER TOURS locations are dropping poker because they say "Players just aren't spending money."

I have seen over the years on this site of players saying "Well its' FREE poker and I don't have to spend any money." Well you are correct. And now look what is happening. Poker is drying up in Denver. So now it is becoming a little harder to find a quality game to go play at.

The DPT is still operating 10 - 15 games a night in the Denver area. We still are doing our best to offer a great product for the great players of Colorado. But for every player that goes into a poker game and doesn't spend any money AT ALL, you should really reevaluate what you are doing. You are the cause of locations making the wait lists be as long as they are, you are the cause for locations simply dropping poker all together, and you are the bane of bars and restaurants around Colorado.

You may insult me or criticize me anyway you want. I don't care. I have had these conversations with restaurant & bar owners around the state. They are happy that people like me and Rico are stepping forward and reminding the "freebie" players that they are creating a problem. The event locations would rather have 15 players spending $20.00 a piece than 30 players spending $5 a piece. And if they don't get it, they will cancel the game.

And instead of criticizing the "poker tours" here in Colorado about this policy or action, why don't you step up to the owner or manager of the bar and explain your actions. Explain how you feel its' ok to sit in their establishment for 3 - 4 hours and refuse to buy anything.

This is a problem for ALL poker tour operators in the state. if you want to try and say your game doesn't have a problem with it, you really might want to pull your head out of the sand.

It is completely insane that someone would go to an restaurant or bar, sit for 3 - 4 hours and not buy anything. Do you do this any other night of the week? Do you walk in on a Sunday afternoon to watch football, take the best seat in the house, sit their all day, and not buy anything?

Yell at me, criticize me, threaten to boycott me, whatever... it is not just my business you are hurting. You're killing the game of poker in Colorado.

GREAT! And I hear Karaoke is making a comeback!


Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour

[pseudoswede]

GREAT! And I hear Karaoke is making a comeback!


pseudoswede runs off to register denverkaraoketour.com ;)

I am probably considered one of the "cheapskates" that the bars don't like. I'll buy one beer (maybe two) and maybe a soda. That's it. I absolutely hate drunk drivers, and to drink more (and risk a DUI) just to save bar poker will never happen for me. And that is all I ever spend in bars, whether it's after work with co-workers or playing bar poker. I tip the bartenders and waitstaff pretty well. If I buy food from the bar, it's because I won a gift certificate when I was there previously. In addition, because I play bar poker so rarely, I lose more gift certificates than I use.

I tip the dealers $2 when I leave the table (either busting out or changing tables), then I tip an extra $5 to the dealer if I place "in the money."

If you, or the bars, consider me a cheapskate, so be it.

[Poker Goddess]

I don't think Brian (or anyone here on the board) would ever advocate drinking to the point that anyone would get a DUI. And, I have a feeling the money made off of a soda is about the same as that made off of a beer (or close). A couple beers, or a couple sodas, from each player would I'm sure be more welcome than nothing at all. I've even heard of people sneaking in their own water, so they don't have to order anything. And also of someone buying one bottle of water and then taking that bottle into the bathroom to refill it rather than buying another one.

Now THAT takes a lot of class.

I sure do hope Brian was wrong about Karaoke being the next big thing though!

Poker Goddess

[Mondogarage]

You know, there is also a bit of a chicken-and-egg thing going on here.

If I'm going out to try a new venue, call the venue hours ahead and sign up, and am told they are running three table....and get there only to find they are only running two, which puts me on a wait list for over an hour, that is a pretty strong disincentive to spend my money in that establishment. If you get me in on false pretenses, you can't expect me to fall over myself giving you money.

I nearly *always* buy dinner at whatever venue I'm playing at. I'll even usually have a beer (if I'm not limited to crap ass choices between Bud, Miller, and Coors), though usually soda afterwards, because of driving issues.

But if the reason for my extended wait *is* the bar, why should I reward that? Unfortunately, that's a problem I've only encountered on the DPT, but it's taken place three of the last four times I attended DPT events (one of the venues has since stopped holding games, as far as I can tell). In each case, the venue ran less tables than they advertised running, or less tables than they had dealers show up for. One venue wouldn't even tell me what number I was on the wait list, when I called in to sign up. I don't say this to single out DPT, because I haven't ever played TPT, don't touch APTstars with a 10-foot pole, and don't know of other tours.

My time is valuable. If I know I'm going to end up on a wait list for a seat at "x" number of tables, that's fine. I can judge the situation and plan accordingly. But if I show up at a venue thinking I'll spend "x" amount of time on the wait list, and suddenly that time triples because the venue was dishonest about the number of tables they run, then they don't deserve my money. The first time it happened, I could accept it at as a misunderstanding. But given the rate I've experienced this occurence, I can only take it that it's the view of multiple venues that it's okay to not be correct on this point -- just do anything you can to get the warm bodies in the door. If they sit around long enough, they're bound to order something. Well, if that's your operating philosophy as a venue, then you're pretty much asking for the clientele you end up with.

I would think this can't be the way 75% of the DPT venues operate, because there's no way they'd still be in business. However, of the last four venues I played, this type of activity took place in three of them (the last three in a row, actually). If a venue treats a patron poorly, that patron will patronize elsewhere.

But my point is really that to assign all the blame here to a certain subset of players is pretty disingenuous, because when certain venues take steps that drive away players who actually spend money, that doesn't leave much other than dudes who like to make their own lemonade, so to speak.

[coloradomrg]

I've sang in a bar once... and my friends couldn't listen to AC/DC for atleast a year without being reminded....

[Poker Goddess]

Mondo -

Well written. I would be frustrated too. I know we have venues that say if there are 18 people total, open a 2nd table because they don't want a wait list. And venues that say if there are 38 people, they will still only run two tables and those who are waiting can just sit and wait (and as you know, not everyone is willing to sit and wait).

I personally think it's a 3 way working triangle for a great consistent game.... a dependable honest tour that has good dealers and great prizes; a bar that is willing to accommodate the players and provide a clean and friendly, well serviced environment; and players who have manners, want to have fun, and support the venues they're playing in.

::sigh:: It all seems so easy...

Poker Goddess

[Mondogarage]

I personally think it's a 3 way working triangle for a great consistent game.... a dependable honest tour that has good dealers and great prizes; a bar that is willing to accommodate the players and provide a clean and friendly, well serviced environment; and players who have manners, want to have fun, and support the venues they're playing in.


Ding ding ding, we have a winnah!

Now, if there were just a tour out there somewhere that could achieve the entire holy trinity of bar poker on a consistent basis... :rolleyes:

Actually, I wasn't going to say it, but the Bit in Longmont seems to do a real good job on all accounts. Always plenty of tables, decent prizes, good food, and while there are a handfull of freeloaders, they seem to sell plenty of food and booze. But they're not part of a tour, per se, and seem to draw a lot of their players from a broader base of folks who are regulars at the Bit to begin with.

[dexman1349]

The key to finding a good game in the bar circuits is like everything else: shop around. Some venues are like the ones previously described: inconsistant waitlists, poor dealers / games, etc. Eventually you find one you like and you learn how to adjust your own schedule to make it more enjoyable.

Every game provides a certain level of convenience. In order for it to be even better, you must adjust yourself a bit too.

I agree with the earlier posts. If we as players are not able to support the establishments that support poker, we will loose an ally in the poker world.

[Crazy Iraqi]

pseudoswede runs off to register denverkaraoketour.com ;)

I am probably considered one of the "cheapskates" that the bars don't like. I'll buy one beer (maybe two) and maybe a soda. That's it. I absolutely hate drunk drivers, and to drink more (and risk a DUI) just to save bar poker will never happen for me.


pseudoswede: bars are happy if you are having one to two beers. The customers that Brian & Rico are complaining about are the customers who come in, order water, play and then leave without spending any money.

One solution if you dont drink. Buy food. If you are at a venue that doesnt serve food, buy a friend a drink. If your friend isnt there that night, buy a new friend a drink. If you dont feel like doing that, please take care of the wait staff with your water. A dollar or two will make them feel a lot better about taking care of you if you take care of them

Crazy Iraqi

(the above opinion was mine and not that of any poker tour operator in the state)

[DenverPokerTour]

Actually Swede... The bars do like you. It's the players who spend absolutely NOTHING that the bars are complaining about. The bars have also told me that the ones who don't spend any money tend to be the ones who take up most of owners, servers, and bartenders time.

I talked with a bar owner last night about this... and during the conversation with him, a player came up and complained that the bar wanted to charge him for a bottle of water. The owner said that since the player was at a bar, he should be expected to buy something. The player then said that he didn't have any money and that's why he came out to play FREE poker. Then the player returned to his seat. The owner looked at me and said "What do I do?" I said, "your bar, your rules". The owner then walked over to the player and asked the player to leave, and the player did, but not before yelling out the top of his lungs of how unfair it was that he had to leave because he wouldn't buy something. The rest of the crowd started laughing and applauding.

Tough situation to be in huh?

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour

[idh78]

The owner then walked over to the player and asked the player to leave, and the player did, but not before yelling out the top of his lungs of how unfair it was that he had to leave because he wouldn't buy something.

Tough situation to be in huh?

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour


Good for him....like Brian said in an earlier post....try going to a bar to watch a sporting event and not order anything...I am sure they will kindly ask you to leave as they have every right to...

just be glad that there are not more places like ESPN Zone that actually have a food and/or drink minimum per hour to keep your seat...

[Mondogarage]

... a player came up and complained that the bar wanted to charge him for a bottle of water. The owner said that since the player was at a bar, he should be expected to buy something. The player then said that he didn't have any money and that's why he came out to play FREE poker. Then the player returned to his seat.

The owner then walked over to the player and asked the player to leave, and the player did, but not before yelling out the top of his lungs of how unfair it was that he had to leave because he wouldn't buy something. The rest of the crowd started laughing and applauding.

That is soooo McAwesome.

If you're too poor to go out, stay the **** home. :-D

[Poker Goddess]

I agree completely Mondo. If you can't afford a couple of sodas, an appetizer, tipping your waitstaff.. then have a 'free' home game and play for buttons or rocks or something.

I like Crazy's idea of if you don't drink, buying someone else something. Make new friends!

I wonder if the same people that never buy anything are the ones that also never tip their dealers? Anyone have an idea about that?

The whole 'something for nothing' socieital mindset is crazymaking at times. Sure the POKER is free... as is the TV that's on the whole time while you're in just about any bar.. but to go there and not support the venue just seems silly to me.

Lori Meyer
Poker Goddess
and now... once in a while Black Jack Dealer! Woooohooo!!!

[idh78]

I wonder if the same people that never buy anything are the ones that also never tip their dealers? Anyone have an idea about that?



I wonder what they would tip if they hit a bad beat up the hill? $2-$3???:-D

[Mondogarage]

I wonder if the same people that never buy anything are the ones that also never tip their dealers? Anyone have an idea about that?


That's pretty much my observation.

I'll admit that, for the most part, I don't join that category of people who tip the dealer before the tournament starts, though I tip pretty consistently all night long when I'm getting cards.

The way I see it, the tips should be coming from those who are getting the hands. Obviously, the dealer doesn't set the cards, but I'm not going to tip getting 2- or 3-outed on the river...the donkey who caught the miracle should be the one toking the dealer. But on nights when I'm catching cards, my tips can easily exceed my dinner bill....

[MuckNutts]

Brian, I get your frustration with the freeloader poker players, but don't you think there's something you could be doing that would be more proactive than name-calling? I witnessed one of your tirades about these "worthless bums" and how you wanted them to "buy something or get the **** out" at one of your former locations and it put me off DPT for the better part of 6 months....and I am one of those who DOES spend $20 a night because I usually have dinner while I'm there. Have you noticed that many of the bars that used to host DPT are still playing under another tour or on their own? Perhaps you're not giving us the whole story here.

Maybe you should stop blaming your problems on your players and start thinking of ways to promote sales at the bars. Trust me, yelling at people has quite the opposite effect.

[DenverPokerTour]

What would you suggest that I do?

How do you balance out the bar owner who wants to make money, and the player who doesn't want to spend it?

As far as a bar running their own game, it is typical of the industry. They feel that it is better feasibly to try to operate their own game, than to pay my company to do it. Probably because some people don't spend any money when they go to a bar. The nerve of them. lol.


Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour

[Brent_in_Aurora]

The root cause of the problem is that the laws restrict poker tourneys. Would you play in a cash tourney at a bar? I would.

How are we going to change the laws?

[DenverPokerTour]

The State of Colorado doesn't want to legalize "cash" poker in any area other than the casinos. Why? Because they don't want to see a poker room at every corner instead of a 7/11. And I don't want to see it that way either.
There have been attempts made to legalize poker, but in specific areas only. This means that there is no way in hell the REAL CASINOS would want for you or me to open a card room in Denver. This would take away their business, and it won't happen.
Remember, Las Vegas casino owners were the majority money sponsor of the groups trying to keep the casinos out of Colorado in the first place back in 1992 or 1993, UNLESS the Las Vegas casino owners were the ones who owned the casino. Take a look at CC/BH/CC now and you'll see that they did it anyway. The majority of the big casinos in Colorado are owned by the major casino operators.
I know it sounds ridiculous, but that is how the industry works.

Stick to playing with your friends and keep the game fun. If you want to play for "real" money go to Las Vegas. It is the people and clubs that advertise their game that are the ones getting nailed all the time.

Go Google "Front Range Poker Supply". they were arrested earlier this month for running cash games in Fort Collins. One of the people arrested was a former employee of mine. He was let go back in February 2007 for his attitude.

They were advertising their game. No too smart.

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour

PS. if it were for a legitimate cause or charity, I would love to play a cash game in a bar. I love playing in charity tournaments anyway.

[nrkofover]

So much to comment on, :).

As someone who is currently working in a bar and have managed clubs in the past, the reality is that owners/managers will try to generate revenue by paying outside sources of entertainment a certain amount of money. If the revenue created doesn't justify the cost, the entertainment changes. It's that simple. I can pay a cover band $800 for a night and if they don't bring in a couple hundred people spending $20 a pop, it's unlikely we'll have them back.

The bar I work at has gone to an in house poker game rather than a company. Their reasoning was simple, they don't believe that big prizes over a month or six months or a year are a draw for paying customers. They feel like dropping a cash prize every night and foregoing the added expense of a company makes the most sense for their clientele. The shift in players since they've dropped their poker company has been better for them all around. Regular customers from the rest of week make it a point to play poker at our bar, they don't wander the other tours, they don't worry about accumulating certs or points, they just like to play cards now and then at a location that they enjoy and appreciates them in return. And we don't have any players anymore that don't spend money, and I mean none. And as well as poker, I run the bar's karaoke night, :), it's been growing exponentially and with both poker and karaoke on Thursdays, the karaoke is definitely outpacing poker in the revenue department. Maybe it is making a comeback, lol.

And tips? I find it amazing that free poker dealers get tipped at all. In Colorado Springs, I've seen dealers get tipped twice (outside of myself) and both occassions were cash prizes for first place. People down here just don't tip the dealers cash (although I get tipped a free drink pretty regularly).

[DenverPokerTour]

Denver Poker Tour Tournament Changes!
EVERY TIME YOU WIN, YOU WIN AGAIN!
Effective immediately, and being pre dated to June 23rd, 2007, every one of your certificates is now worth more chips at every monthly.
Every time that you win a First Place Qualifying Certificate, you will receive 1000 in chips at our monthly tournament event for the Monthly Winner's Tournament held for the previous month's winners. There is no limit to the amount of certificates that you can use at these monthly events. If you win once in a month, you will start with 1000 in chips, and if you win fifteen times in a month, you will start with 15,000 in chips. That means the more times you play, the more chances you have at winning!

The date for the Semi-Finals has been set!

The Semi-Finals for the State of Colorado will be held April 18th and 19th, 2008 in the Denver area. The players will compete down to the final 15%, which will then move on the the National Championships to be held April 26th, 2008 in Denver, Colorado as well. The players who have taken 1st, 2nd, or 3rd at our previous monthly events have automatically qualified to participate in the National Championships. At the National Championships, all players will start with 10,000 in chips.

How the Denver Semi-Finals will be run:

Once again, every certificate you win is now worth more chips. Here is the formula:

If you have:

1 - 3 Certificates .... you will start with 5000 in chips.
4 - 6 Certificates .... you will start with 7500 in chips
7 - 8 Certificates .... you will start with 10,000 in chips

Each Certificate that you have over eight (8), is worth an additional 1000 in chips each.

The MAXIMUM amount of starting chips in the Denver Semi-Final will be 20,000!

You may use any and all valid DPT Certificates from June 22nd, 2007 up until Midnight April 18th, 2008.

We hope these changes will make your game a little more enjoyable, rewarding, and competitive!

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour

[nrkofover]

It's amazing, I just expressed how so many players could give a damn about the big prizes, which I don't even know what they are with DPT, even with the new rules, but DPT makes it a point to express the positivity of spending $3000 over a year to win a $2000 prize package. Wow.

Hey Brian, try this. Express what it takes to make players happy. And the bars.

I would assume if you give a ****e about poker you would express the comfort of bars running their own games for the value of poker, but of course we all know that you don't care at all about poker, if you could run karaoke with the same profit margin you would.

Donk.

Maybe I should play DPT events without spending anyting, at least that way I profit if I do well.

[DenverPokerTour]

Donk?

I don't care about the game?

Spend $3000 to win $2000. What the hell are you talking about?

Really, tell you what... let me know when you play in the WSOP sometime. In fact, let me know when you cash at the WSOP ,WPT, or any other major poker tournament. Not only have I cashed MAJOR in these tournaments this year alone, AND DPT HAS MANY OF THEIR PLAYERS CASHING IN THE BIG EVENTS TOO!

Oh yeah, that's right. You're too busy playing FREE poker in the Springs and not spending any money, or tipping the dealers, or anything else as your previous posts have made. All you do is whine! Complain! Nag! *****!

But hey, go ahead and tell me how to run my MULTIMILLION dollar business.

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour

PS. In the Denver area, i is common courtesy for a patron to show their appreciation when receiving good service. It is called tipping. Maybe this practice will catch on in the Springs. Or maybe the dealers aren't providing good service that would justify a tip?

[loomisdl]

Brian, how do you cash in all of these events? It doesn't seem to take much effort to put you on tilt.....

:)

[dexman1349]

Brian has two different levels of tilt:

1) Poker tilt

2) Crazy pissed off poker forum tilt.

:-D

[DenverPokerTour]

I luv you guyz....

Don't forget drunk poker tilt.

Actually the game itself doesn't bother me. It is the people who just whine and complain all day that do. Let me give you an example of a hand last week.


I have the sb $10.00 and 6 / 7 off suit
Guy to my right has BB $20.00
Player 3 calls the $20.00
All but one fold...
Player 4 on my right calls $20
I am sitting on $1200.00 in chips, so I call for $10.00 after I say "I can't these cards even for $10.00" another player says "sure you can", so I did.

Flop comes Kh, 6s, 7h, and I just start laughing.
I check.Player 2 bets $20.00, Player 3 calls $20.00, Player 4 calls $20.00
Hell, I have to call.
Turn comes Ks
Well my hand is now dead, so i check, P2 checks, P3 checks, P4 checks
River comes 3h
Now I am still dead, I check. P2 checks, P 3 goes all in for $800.00. Player 4 calls, I fold, P2 folds.
P3 shows pocket 10's... P4 has Ah, Jh.... player 3 starts to complain about how P4 doesn't know how to play. They start going at it back and forth, and P3 want for me to tell P4 what an idiot he is for playing is AJh...

I just started laughing again.

I don't go on tilt during the game. I go on tilt when people try to tell me how to operate my business. If you don't like the way my game runs, then play somewhere else. But i think it is funny when someone who works at ONE bar tells me how to run my games in the 150 bars that I do across the nation.

But hey, everyone is entitled to their opinions in this world but me.

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour


PS. The World Series of Poker Circuit is coming to Council Bluffs, in February. There is a group of 30 of us that have already made our reservations and flights. Last year, Larry Davis, a player sponsored by the DPT got 8th Place and cashed in for 5 figures, Mike from Denver got 5th (also 5 figures) , and Jeff from Colorado Springs took 3rd (high 5 figures). Maybe these are some of the guys who play for more than just a nightly bar tab.

Player 1 -

[dexman1349]

Brian,

Sorry I missed the last type of tilt, I'll add it to the list for next time. :D

You illustrated the point trying to be made by others very well in the end of your last post. You have over 150 bars, with at least 10 players each (required to sit at least one table), and assuming the players for each bar only play at the one bar equals over 1500 players. You illustrated 3 successful people (although I'm sure there are a few more out there). That's only 0.2% of the entire DPT population.

The point was that the majority of the players only care about the nightly event. I'm sure if you gave every player a seat in a WSOP or WPT qualifier, a large portion would not complain about it, but that was probably not their main goal when they sat down at the table at Shotgun Willy's.


Edit: I would have called the pocket 10's a donk out of your example. All in with pocket 10's with a pair on the board and a possible heart flush? He went all in for $800 to win a pot of $160? Honestly if I was in the flush's seat when all was said and done, I would have thanked the 10's for the free money.

I've found that yelling at other players at any game never ends up turning out ok. Too much added tension and stress.

[Mondogarage]

I luv you guyz....

Actually the game itself doesn't bother me. It is the people who just whine and complain all day that do. Let me give you an example of a hand last week.

I have the sb $10.00 and 6 / 7 off suit
Guy to my right has BB $20.00
Player 3 calls the $20.00
All but one fold...
Player 4 on my right calls $20
I am sitting on $1200.00 in chips, so I call for $10.00 after I say "I can't these cards even for $10.00" another player says "sure you can", so I did.

Flop comes Kh, 6s, 7h, and I just start laughing.
I check.Player 2 bets $20.00, Player 3 calls $20.00, Player 4 calls $20.00
Hell, I have to call.
Turn comes Ks
Well my hand is now dead, so i check, P2 checks, P3 checks, P4 checks
River comes 3h
Now I am still dead, I check. P2 checks, P 3 goes all in for $800.00. Player 4 calls, I fold, P2 folds.
P3 shows pocket 10's... P4 has Ah, Jh.... player 3 starts to complain about how P4 doesn't know how to play. They start going at it back and forth, and P3 want for me to tell P4 what an idiot he is for playing is AJh...



For what it's worth, you should have CR that flop to about 240 and make P2, P3, and P4 make, at best, marginal calls. Calling gives you no information at all on the quality of their draws, and you're ahead of almost all holdings in the spot. If you're not going to play bottom two in a multi-way drawy board aggressively, the flop call will usually bring a turn fold, and your flop call is dead money. If anyone shoves over your CR, you can still fold.

:-D

What were we talking about now?

[Hollyann]

PS. In the Denver area, it is common courtesy for a patron to show their appreciation when receiving good service. It is called tipping. Maybe this practice will catch on in the Springs. Or maybe the dealers aren't providing good service that would justify a tip?

As a DPT dealer working in Colorado Springs, I'd HAVE to say it must be that the dealers aren't providing a service worth tipping... since I make plenty in tips dealing my games. Nice to know that I am doing a much better job than the dealers for the other tours in town. :) Last time I dealt, I made twice what Brian's paying me to deal in my tips, and that isn't out of the ordinary for me. Tips are a bonus, a reward for a job well done, not something the dealer, bartender, waitress, delivery guy, stripper, whatever should EXPECT. If everyone that worked for tips put that straight in their heads and provided a service that reflected that they were TRYING to earn a tip, rather than EXPECTING one simply for showing up, they would make a lot more money.

There are a lot of fundamental differences with games, players, and bars between Colorado Springs and Denver, but to my personal experience, tipping isn't one of them.

[DenverPokerTour]

Last Saturday I was in Grand Junction working a corporate "casino" night party. I arrived at 4 PM to set up the music, casino equip, and meet with the host. At 6 PM I returned to play the music while they ate dinner. At 8 Pm to 10:30 PM we ran a craps, Roulette, 4 BJ, and 2 Poker tables. This event was for 125 people.

Now we get paid to be at this event and deal, but even then the host of the event came over to me and handed myself and all 8 other dealers a $100.00 tip EACH. Before I could say anything, he stated "You are so much better than the company we used to hire. I will never use them again, and I wanted your staff to know how great of a job they did,"

That's why you provide great service. Because sometimes people actually appreciate it.

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour